Climate Change

[Bluey]

Another thing to remember, if we were to halt every ounce of carbon being emitted by this country, ie kill every domestic animal and cease all industry and electricity generation the savings made by this would be overtaken by the increases from China and India in one week.

 

[MegaRabbitoh]

A 10 minute ABC production on the pause, ie where warming halted at a time of dramatic increases of carbon for China and India.
And lets not forget carbon makes up just .4% of the earths atmosphere

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Natural fluctuations will always occur but the long term trend is undeniable unfortunately. We're in trouble long term if we don't make significant changes and that is not hysteria, it's just bloody obvious.

Oh, and when I say "we" I mean the world, not just Australia.

 

[MegaRabbitoh]

Change towards clean energy and organic food should be phased in gradually and sensibly for it become sustainable. Halting everything all at once is crazy and very few people are calling for that so it is a straw man argument.

 

[southsport]

Change towards clean energy and organic food should be phased in gradually and sensibly for it become sustainable. Halting everything all at once is crazy and very few people are calling for that so it is a straw man argument.

Agree but that's not what the guardian says.

The climate disaster is here – this is what the future looks like

Earth is already becoming unlivable. Will governments act to stop this disaster from getting worse?

www.theguardian.com

 

[bigbopper]

Essentially, the widely held belief that it is an emergency or crisis is based on the upward trend of global average temperatures above the pre-industrial age average reaching a tipping point of irreversible disastrous consequences once that average increase in global temperatures exceeds 1.5 and then 2.0 degrees. Currently it is said to be at 1.1 above and already we are seeing extreme weather conditions and changes in all directions as a result and as predicted.

I have no doubt that globally, it is an emergency and humanity can't afford to be slowed and delayed any more.

Climate change is a ‘global emergency’, people say in biggest ever climate poll

Almost two-thirds of over 1.2 million people surveyed worldwide say that climate change is a global emergency, urging greater action to address the crisis, results from a new UN climate survey revealed on Wednesday.

news.un.org

Facts about the climate emergency

The science of climate change is well established: Climate change is real and human activities are the main cause. (IPCC) The concentration of greenhouse gases in the earth’s atmosphere is directly linked to the average global temperature on Earth. (IPCC) The concentration has been rising...

www.unep.org

https://www.bbc.com/news/newsbeat-47570654

It's the "irrerversible disastrous consequences" that I have a concern about. Firstly "as predicted" - just taking a few randomly, the UN told us that there would be 50 million climate refugees by 2010, we heard that polar bears would be extinct by 2015, that Pacific Islands would be inundated (in fact the University of Auckland study showed their land mass is increasing), that our (Australia's) dams would never fill again (how useful is Sydney's desalination plant looking?), that snow would disappear from our snowfields (they are in the midst of a bumper season) etc. I've lost count of the number of "tipping points"(from memory the first was 1990). Some years ago Prince Charles said the world has 100 months to do something (we missed that).

Predicting what will happen is fraught.

A little while ago Professor Andy Pittman, Director of the ARC Centre of Excellence for Climate Extremes (based in ANU) declared that there was no link between climate change and drought in Australia - he said he had over a hundred years of data to prove it. I listened to the talk he gave online. Unfortunately Andrew Bolt got hold of it and declared it the "smoking gun" that disproved climate change (a nonsense argument). Pittman then said he "misspoke" and meant to say no "direct" link. I listened to the talk and he didn't seem to misspeak. But direct link or not Pittman was clearly saying that climate change was not causing droughts in Australia.

The Great Barrier Reef (which I think is in serious danger from climate change) was said to be doomed. Then our scientists discovered that it was much more resilient than first thought (i.e., they got it wrong) and could survive if the increase was held to 1.5 degrees (by coincidence the IPCC target). So their new catch cry is "The Reef's alive at 1.5".

I think there has been too much panic and not enough thought given to both prevention of temperature increases and mitigating the effects of such rises. Humans have adapted to lots of changes over time - the last really big one was when the ice blanket covering much of North America (covering thousands of square kilometres and up to three or four kilometres deep) melted. It inundated islands and low lying areas, flooded the Black Sea (which was arable land), changed currents and jet streams, created deserts and forests etc.

We recently had our largest ever bushfire in temperate forests. Was this the result of climate change? Or was the failure to clear debris, undertake proper back burning, maintain fire trails, etc, contributing factors? We should learn lessons from the Indigenous population on how to manage our fire prone environment.

There is just so much to discuss and there is not enough space here to do it justice.

Cheers

 

[Bluey]

Do we all remember the so called expert Chris Flannery who declared " not even the rain that does fall will fill our dams", how do Sydney people feel about that forecast now?,or the other fraud Al Gore who bought a mansion with waterfront views that chews up 21 times more energy than the average USA home, what a hypocrite, or then there Greta Thornburg the snarling girl telling us all how we ruined her childhood yet has made a million bucks from ranting how evil we all are while she jets around Europe..

 

[southsport]

How organics left Sri Lanka in a mess​

The massive failure in Sri Lanka that has unfurled over the past 18 months provides a warning to other nations as to what can happen if overambitious green policies are pursued too rapidly and too aggressively.
.

 

[MegaRabbitoh]

Do we all remember the so called expert Chris Flannery who declared " not even the rain that does fall will fill our dams", how do Sydney people feel about that forecast now?,or the other fraud Al Gore who bought a mansion with waterfront views that chews up 21 times more energy than the average USA home, what a hypocrite, or then there Greta Thornburg the snarling girl telling us all how we ruined her childhood yet has made a million bucks from ranting how evil we all are while she jets around Europe..

B.S. Pure and simple.

 

[MegaRabbitoh]

How organics left Sri Lanka in a mess​

The massive failure in Sri Lanka that has unfurled over the past 18 months provides a warning to other nations as to what can happen if overambitious green policies are pursued too rapidly and too aggressively.
.

They did it all in one go instead of phasing it in gradually which was stupid. That’s all their example proves. Cheering this on appears like hysterics to me.

 

[Bluey]

And there you go, you dismiss anything that doesnt go your way, its fact what Flannery said, as is Gores mansion, chew and swallow boy, now stop responding to posts, you have zero....

B.S. Pure and simple.

 

[MegaRabbitoh]

It's the "irrerversible disastrous consequences" that I have a concern about. Firstly "as predicted" - just taking a few randomly, the UN told us that there would be 50 million climate refugees by 2010, we heard that polar bears would be extinct by 2015, that Pacific Islands would be inundated (in fact the University of Auckland study showed their land mass is increasing), that our (Australia's) dams would never fill again (how useful is Sydney's desalination plant looking?), that snow would disappear from our snowfields (they are in the midst of a bumper season) etc. I've lost count of the number of "tipping points"(from memory the first was 1990). Some years ago Prince Charles said the world has 100 months to do something (we missed that).

Predicting what will happen is fraught.

A little while ago Professor Andy Pittman, Director of the ARC Centre of Excellence for Climate Extremes (based in ANU) declared that there was no link between climate change and drought in Australia - he said he had over a hundred years of data to prove it. I listened to the talk he gave online. Unfortunately Andrew Bolt got hold of it and declared it the "smoking gun" that disproved climate change (a nonsense argument). Pittman then said he "misspoke" and meant to say no "direct" link. I listened to the talk and he didn't seem to misspeak. But direct link or not Pittman was clearly saying that climate change was not causing droughts in Australia.

The Great Barrier Reef (which I think is in serious danger from climate change) was said to be doomed. Then our scientists discovered that it was much more resilient than first thought (i.e., they got it wrong) and could survive if the increase was held to 1.5 degrees (by coincidence the IPCC target). So their new catch cry is "The Reef's alive at 1.5".

I think there has been too much panic and not enough thought given to both prevention of temperature increases and mitigating the effects of such rises. Humans have adapted to lots of changes over time - the last really big one was when the ice blanket covering much of North America (covering thousands of square kilometres and up to three or four kilometres deep) melted. It inundated islands and low lying areas, flooded the Black Sea (which was arable land), changed currents and jet streams, created deserts and forests etc.

We recently had our largest ever bushfire in temperate forests. Was this the result of climate change? Or was the failure to clear debris, undertake proper back burning, maintain fire trails, etc, contributing factors? We should learn lessons from the Indigenous population on how to manage our fire prone environment.

There is just so much to discuss and there is not enough space here to do it justice.

Cheers

Some of the more specific predictions have been over blown and far fetched but the macro science and macro predictions are undeniable. That's what I prefer to focus on. Droughts and floods are caused by the same things that have always caused them. Climate change exacerbates them. That's the key to how I understand it. The bushfires were so extreme because the drought was and the drivers behind it, El Nino was the cause but it was a more severe one. Same now with La Nina. The extremes are becoming the norm. That can't be a coincidence and that is what was predicted. Getting too micro about this prediction or that made by individuals way back is missing the point I think.

The cynics and big business interests look to seize on the doubts and sew further uncertainty to derail efforts to do anything at all about it and we lurch further into disaster. As soon as the Republicans get back into power in the US, they'll tear down as much of it as they can and set us back yet again - same in Aus once power changes hands again.

 

[MegaRabbitoh]

And there you go, you dismiss anything that doesnt go your way, its fact what Flannery said, as is Gores mansion, chew and swallow boy, now stop responding to posts, you have zero....

Shut up fool! i have a right to my opinion too and a right to call out B.S. as I see it!

 

[VIP]

Shut up fool! i have a right to my opinion too and a right to call out B.S. as I see it!

There’s no need for name calling is there?

 

[MegaRabbitoh]

There’s no need for name calling is there?

Disagree. He's being foolish and getting personal with me which is uncalled for and I am just pointing it out.

He called me a boy in his post too, to be fair. Very condescending.

 

[Bluey]

No your being a little girl who is blinkered to one idea like a religion, and you throw childish little barbs trying to be smart, if you cant debate without throwing dolly then you lose every time...

Disagree. He's being foolish and getting personal with me whish is uncalled for and I am just pointing it out.