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We Don’t Seem To Win Close Games

Pplspoet

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This is something I’ve kinda felt might be a thing for a while.

So with the new season coming up, I figured it was worth checking the actual results.

Because 2024 was such a disaster, let’s park that for a second and instead just look at 2022 and 2023. The period post-Wayne, but while we were still a serious footy team and with most of the same senior players that are still at the club (we can come back to 2024).

In 2022 we:

- Won 14 games and lost 10

- Of those 14 wins, 1 was by a margin of 7 points or less

- Of those 10 losses, 5 were by a margin of 7 points or less

- 12 of our 14 wins were by 12 points or more

So right there, that essentially backs up that feeling that I don’t recall us winning many games where the result was in the balance with minutes to play.

TLDR: We had a 17% win rate in games where the final margin was 7 points or less.

In 2023 we:

- Won 12 games and lost 12

- Of those 12 wins, 2 were by a margin of 7 points or less (a golden point win vs Manly, and the miracle finish vs the Panthers in Penrith where we scored on the buzzer in spectacular fashion)

- Of those 12 losses, 5 were by a margin of 7 points or less

- 9 of our 12 wins were by 12 points or more

So again, pretty much the same pattern presenting in those numbers too.

TLDR: The extra win gives us a win percentage of 29% in games where the final margin was 7 points or less (across both seasons the combined percentage is 23%).

I won’t go into 2024 because dusturbing that data feels like it could unleash a long-dormant plague. Suffice to say, 1 of our 7 wins was by 7 points or less (against the Dogs).

Now, what this all means is entirely up for interpretation and discussion.

Maybe it’s nothing.

Maybe it’s a good thing. Perhaps those games we lost by narrow margins we actually did well to get that close, and the games we won, we won easily.

Maybe it says when ‘we’re on’ we’re really on. If we have you’re number, we’ll win by 2 tries or more.

Maybe it just shows we control games better when we have a bit of a scoreboard buffer.

Maybe it says we have a cultural approach of ‘when the going gets tough, we look to next week’.

Interested in people’s thoughts.

I haven’t looked at the results from Wayne’s last stint, but the team is so different now (post Reyno, Gagai and Sua) that it feels somewhat unrelated.

Yobbo, I’m sure you’ll have some statistical insight into whether this is a relevant pattern or not.
 
NB: this thread was drafted prior to the Cam Murray news.
 
I share the sentiment ppls. In the last few years I have not been confident that we win close matches. Contrast this with the Madge years where I had no worry in the world.
 
Interesting assessment and I have thought the same for a while now.

I still put it down to a lack of resilience and weak mentality under Demetriou.
 
Very interesting point, I think a lot comes down to our game managing clutch 7 leaving, but I agree when the going does get tough and our pack is not able to win momentum were very poor especially as illias kicking game didn't help us and Cody (and on occasion Latrell) are prone to going missing in those type of situations. A good example of this was when JD it became prevalent that when we conceded points they tend to come in bunches, like the 2020 prelim where we let in 2 quick tries and then our heads seemed to go down in the 2nd half and it was quite a calamity.
 
The trouble with just looking at the final score is that it may not tell the complete story.

Scenario 1

Souths are leading by 4 between minutes 65 and 79. We score a last minute converted try and the win is by 10 (that is more than 7). But was a game in which the result was in doubt until the 79th minute.

Scenario 2

Souths are trailing by 16 with 5 minutes to go. We score 2 quick fire converted tries and we lose by 4 (less than 7). But that result was never in doubt. We did not 'lose a close game'. We essentially scored 2 late tries that meant nothing in terms of the result.

You can't simply look at the final score to see if we have a good record in tight matches. You to look at what the score was in the closing 10 minutes.
 
Souths' results when the margin is <= 7 points after the 70th minute:

2024 - 2 games, 1 won, 1 lost
2023 - 4 games, 3 won, 1 lost
2022 - 6 games, 2 won, 4 lost

Overall since 2022: 12 games, 6 won, 6 lost

It's more interesting to me that we've only been in 12 games (of 75) since 2022 where the margin has been close after 70 minutes.

We either win big or lose big... which anecdotally seems to line up with how we've played (we're either "on" or we're not and you can tell pretty early on in games).
 
This thread is looking like the opposite of one of those horror finals threads we had in 2023 I think it was that sunk our season 😝

You say ‘one of those threads’.

It was my thread about Top 2 a certainty that sank the season.

Happy to help out where I can. :)
 

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